+- +-

+-User

Welcome, Guest.
Please login or register.
 
 
 
Forgot your password?

+-Gallery

Shoutbox

combat32 says: Happy Thanksgiving
combat32 says: just realized i brewed my 75th batch of homebrew  :D
combat32 says: Happy Halloween
combat32 says: i got stuck in mine once...had to drink my way out 8)
Brew Beerymore says: I was hiding in my kegerator, combat. Sorry about that.
combat32 says: where is everyone??
Jon Turner says: :)
officialbeyn says: 17  ;)
combat32 says: Happy 4th of July
combat32 says: Strat Memorial Brew day is only a week away

+-Top Posters

combat32
Posts: 3837
vic
Posts: 3641
DamoNinja
Posts: 2865
CorronZenith
Posts: 2764
Greedy Dragon Brewing
Posts: 2496

Author Topic: 5 & 7  (Read 8030 times)

CraigTube

  • Technical brewer
  • Hero Member

  • Offline
  • *****

  • 518
5 & 7
« on: October 23, 2015, 04:56:35 AM »
Hi guys. I get asked a lot about what I call "The 5 & 7". This topic won't apply to all-grain or partial extract brewing, but there are still a lot people out there who brew the pre-hopped kits and are wanting to step up from "Kit & Kilo". This is for them.

This is a very detailed explanation of the "5 & 7" and why I came up with it.

The easiest way to start moving away from adding so much dextrose to your beer is to start using more malt. Often, the easiest way to do this is to just substitute some or all of the dextrose with Dry Malt, which is a powdered form of the gooey stuff in the can. This will give your beer more body and flavor. Sometimes a combination of Dry Malt and Dextrose is a good idea. It saves a bit of money (dry malt is a bit expensive) and it won't drastically change the style or colour of your beer.

The reason for trying to reduce the amount of Dextrose in your beer is because Dextrose will increase the ABV, but it won't add any supporting proteins or body to the beer. The more alcohol in your beer, the thinner it will be and it won't hold up any foam or have much of a mouth feel.

Coopers has what they call their "Brew Enhancers". One of these is sort of a balance between Dextrose and Dry Malt. Here's what's in it: 500g Dextrose, 250g Dry Malt, 250g Maltodextrin.

Maltodextrin is used to improve head retention and mouth-feel, but it does not ferment into alcohol.

If you wanted to save money, you could make your own Brew Enhancer. I think Coopers charges around $8 where I live, and here's the thing... It doesn't have as much fermentability as 1Kilo of dextrose. So when you replace your Kilo of Dextrose with this Brew Enhancer, your ABV is going to drop at least one percent. Bummer. Here's why...

It has 500g of Dextrose... all good there. 250g of Dry Malt, which is about the same as 200g of Dextrose as far as fermentability. 250g of Maltodextrin, which has little to no fermentability. Therefore, Brew Enhancer with these ingredients only offers 70% of the fermentability of 1Kilo of Dextrose. Your beer will taste fine, but you'll notice a drop in your "buzz".

So, here's what I thought... Let's increase the Dry Malt from 250g to 500g. That will eliminate the need for the Maltodextrin because Dry Malt adds the same body, plus it ferments. So, we're half way there. Let's make up the other half of this "Enhancer" by adding the same 500g of Dextrose that Coopers did. Now, we have 1Kilo "Brew Enhancer". But wait... That still doesn't add up to the same fermentability as 1Kilo of Dextrose because Dry malt only has about 80% fermentability compared with Dextrose. Well then we'll just add another 200g of Dextrose to make up for that. Now we have 500g of Dry Malt and 700g of Dextrose. The "5 & 7".

Both Dry Malt and Dextrose can be bought in bulk for pretty cheap, and they keep in sealed containers for years. Now, here's how you add them to your kit.

You will need to give them a quick boil to sanitize them, because they were in bulk. Bring about 4 liters of water to the boil (that's about 1 Gallon for you Americans). Then add your Dry Malt FIRST. Stir until all the lumps are gone, then (and only then) add your Dextrose. The reason is that Dry malt is hard to dissolve, and if the Dextrose is added first, you'll end up with Rock Candy. Once these are both nicely dissolved and brought to a boil for 5 minutes or so, just strike them in with your pre-hopped kit, and finish up the way you normally do. Brew to 20L by the way. Your beer will taste just that little bit better.

Use "Light" Dry Malt for this, unless you want to darken your beer. If you're brewing a stout, well, I've never done the 5 & 7 with a stout, but see what it says on the can and derive your 5 & 7 from that. They may say to add darker Dry Malt. You could do 250g Light and 250g Dark.

But anyway, that's the "5 & 7" and the reason for its inception. Any time anyone asks, you can link them to this thread. Hope this helps!

Cheers
Craig
« Last Edit: October 30, 2015, 10:21:36 AM by CraigTube »

eggy79

  • Hero Member

  • Offline
  • *****

  • 567
Re: 5 & 7
« Reply #1 on: October 23, 2015, 05:01:51 AM »
Great explanation Craig.

Given it is a regular question from brewers perhaps the mods could make this a sticky...
Garde Zythum

Brew Beerymore

  • Superhero Member

  • Offline
  • *****
  • Technician's Brewery

  • 1330
    • My youtube channel
Re: 5 & 7
« Reply #2 on: October 23, 2015, 05:37:38 AM »
Great explanation Craig.

Given it is a regular question from brewers perhaps the mods could make this a sticky...


Good call. Stickied ;)
FV 1: Dark Christmas Ale (CC)


Tap 1:
Tap 2:

CorronZenith

  • Technical brewer
  • Superhero Member

  • Offline
  • *****
  • "Easy As!"

  • 2764
  • Personal Text
    "Making awesome beer... It's Easy As!!"
    • CorronZenith YouTube Channel:
Re: 5 & 7
« Reply #3 on: October 23, 2015, 09:13:11 AM »
Sweet! Good call Craig - more malt the better!

Sent from my SM-G900I using Tapatalk


SmokeyMcB

  • Full Member

  • Offline
  • ***
  • The Cooker of the Foods

  • 210
  • Personal Text
    Wild Boloney Brewing
Re: 5 & 7
« Reply #4 on: October 23, 2015, 04:55:06 PM »
Bring about 4 liters of water to the boil (that's about 0.5 Gallons for you Americans).


Not to be nit-picky but 4l is just over 1 us gallon...
I'se da B'ye!!

I may not be as good as I once was, but I'm as good once as I ever was!!

CraigTube

  • Technical brewer
  • Hero Member

  • Offline
  • *****

  • 518
Re: 5 & 7
« Reply #5 on: October 24, 2015, 10:35:27 AM »
Good reason why we should all use the same measurements. :)


Homebrew and Forager

  • Newbie

  • Offline
  • *

  • 3
Re: 5 & 7
« Reply #6 on: October 25, 2015, 04:30:35 AM »
Thanks for pointing me in the direction of this Craig, great explanation  ;)  Can I ask the guys in the uk, where do you get your dry malt from online and is there any good brands to get and bad ones to avoid.  There no home brew shops near me that stock dry malt so I'm forced to buy online. Thank you.

JIGSAW

  • Sr. Member

  • Offline
  • ****

  • 252
  • Personal Text
    BIAB Brewer
    • COMPUTEK
Re: 5 & 7
« Reply #7 on: October 30, 2015, 09:24:26 AM »
Bring about 4 liters of water to the boil (that's about 0.5 Gallons for you Americans).


Not to be nit-picky but 4l is just over 1 us gallon...

Good reason why we should all use the same measurements. :)

I would suggest that the OP be corrected ... not everyone is gonna read the commends  ;)
The Problem With The World Is That Everyone Is A Few Drinks Behind.!


CraigTube

  • Technical brewer
  • Hero Member

  • Offline
  • *****

  • 518
Re: 5 & 7
« Reply #8 on: October 30, 2015, 10:31:11 AM »
Bring about 4 liters of water to the boil (that's about 0.5 Gallons for you Americans).


Not to be nit-picky but 4l is just over 1 us gallon...


Corrected. Thanks. It's hard working in gallons because one U.S. Gallon is 0.83 Imperial Gallons. This is true with other measurements to, like Tabespoons and Cups. A 5 U.S. Gallon batch of beer is a 4.16 Gallon batch everywhere else. That makes beer recipes hard to fallow. You have to know where the recipe was made. I guess that's why us brewers, including myself, should talk metric whenever possible. Temperature is one thing I will always measure in F in stead of C, because F is more precise.


Cheers!
Craig

Sig brew

  • Full Member

  • Offline
  • ***

  • 134
Re: 5 & 7
« Reply #9 on: October 31, 2015, 09:55:25 PM »
Great explanation Craig.

Given it is a regular question from brewers perhaps the mods could make this a sticky...


the 5 and 7 is great to use for pre hopped extracts


Sammy

  • Newbie

  • Offline
  • *

  • 1
Re: 5 & 7
« Reply #10 on: November 01, 2015, 06:02:31 PM »
Quote
Can I ask the guys in the uk, where do you get your dry malt from online

I don't get mine online but from Wilkinsons, they do a dextrose with Dry Malt (50/50)
for about £6

hope this helps

SGDrummer23

  • Newbie

  • Offline
  • *

  • 10
    • Whitewater Pass
Re: 5 & 7
« Reply #11 on: November 04, 2015, 03:07:51 PM »
Thanks for the explanation, Craig!

dripstick

  • Newbie

  • Offline
  • *

  • 9
Re: 5 & 7
« Reply #12 on: November 23, 2015, 03:18:28 PM »
I always use Craig's 5 & 7 method with no complaints.

Cheers

strat

  • Superhero Member

  • Offline
  • *****

  • 1086
    • https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCV5rdR-gd5x4NAVLxnFyxCw/feed
Re: 5 & 7
« Reply #13 on: November 29, 2015, 03:46:21 PM »
When I make a coopers kit I like the 5 and 7 with a few more added hops  Cheers

OleBno2000

  • Newbie

  • Offline
  • *

  • 2
Re: 5 & 7
« Reply #14 on: December 19, 2015, 05:08:24 PM »
Hi Craig

Thank you a lot for the explanation of this.  I will try it out on my next batch of Coopers  ;D

Best Regards
OleB


 

Recent Topics

Willamette Hops by BoggeMan
Today at 08:26:12 AM

Fermentasaurus review part 1 [VIDEO] by DrHans
Today at 12:21:17 AM

Brewing a Chocolate Coconut Porter by WattyForFun
December 10, 2017, 09:37:42 PM

What did you just pour? New Thread by CorronZenith
December 10, 2017, 06:16:20 AM

What's everyone brewing?? by combat32
December 09, 2017, 01:25:04 PM

You tube by Bonesy01
December 07, 2017, 11:23:08 PM

NEIPA from a Coopers Pale Ale kit by Gash Slugg
December 06, 2017, 10:13:41 PM

Crushed by BigEd
December 06, 2017, 04:17:13 PM

starter blow out on stove by -Zrognak-
December 06, 2017, 03:27:37 PM

Orange zest by -Zrognak-
December 06, 2017, 03:20:56 PM

Expired coopers canned malt kit by Trurobrew
December 05, 2017, 01:48:36 PM

Hello from the UK (South East England) by Sheltoncds
December 05, 2017, 10:20:14 AM

Cold Crashing by Brew Beerymore
December 05, 2017, 02:27:48 AM

Sticky T. and Yates colab brown! by StickyTentacles
December 04, 2017, 02:56:14 PM

kolsch beer by Sheltoncds
December 03, 2017, 05:49:14 PM

Belgian Tripel yeast options by Playground
December 03, 2017, 05:40:58 PM

High vs Low Alpha Bittering Hops by combat32
December 03, 2017, 09:02:31 AM

Bochet by -Zrognak-
December 02, 2017, 09:50:13 AM

How do you make your starter? by combat32
December 01, 2017, 09:21:15 PM

Keg scales by combat32
November 30, 2017, 08:52:55 AM

Welcome by Brew Beerymore
November 30, 2017, 05:55:24 AM

Perlick 650ss flow control faucets by Brew Beerymore
November 29, 2017, 05:44:22 AM

My first home brew by Brew Beerymore
November 29, 2017, 05:36:39 AM

Ahoy from Australia! by Brew Beerymore
November 29, 2017, 05:16:52 AM

Small wine flasks by -Zrognak-
November 27, 2017, 04:58:46 PM

kegeraters by combat32
November 27, 2017, 07:45:04 AM

Old brews and a bass project by StickyTentacles
November 26, 2017, 11:54:13 AM

What was and still is your favorite music? by -Zrognak-
November 26, 2017, 09:27:05 AM

Online Deals by -Zrognak-
November 25, 2017, 11:33:16 AM

Christmas Ale Help by combat32
November 24, 2017, 07:13:34 PM

Coopers IPA (5&7) + 50g Hop 10 min. Boil tea enogh? by combat32
November 24, 2017, 07:12:19 PM

brew Log Template by combat32
November 20, 2017, 07:44:06 AM

Hello from Louisiana USA by Warayurt
November 20, 2017, 05:23:13 AM

Epic Armageddon IPA by TowelBoy2013
November 19, 2017, 05:53:22 PM

Building the 17 Black IPA recipe by Jaymcmlxx
November 19, 2017, 04:04:14 PM

What are you bottling/kegging? by Playground
November 19, 2017, 03:41:15 PM

Bananananananananananana....... by Ouroboros
November 19, 2017, 04:09:10 AM

Induction Burners by Ouroboros
November 19, 2017, 03:50:36 AM

Justintv by Trurobrew
November 18, 2017, 12:27:26 PM

Common???? by Dark_Loki
November 16, 2017, 11:53:55 AM

Bottling my first brew by combat32
November 15, 2017, 07:37:17 AM

Bottling day by combat32
November 13, 2017, 08:36:22 PM

Yeast amount by RuairidhMD
November 13, 2017, 05:26:19 PM

Extract Kits - who has the best prices? by Trurobrew
November 12, 2017, 02:22:58 PM

Wheat beer on the go! by Hplovecraft07
November 10, 2017, 05:18:38 PM

Pumpkin ale!! Review! by Hplovecraft07
November 10, 2017, 05:17:10 PM

Many thanks to Aussie brew brothers CZ,,,VIC,,,,TAS,,,ANDDDDDDDPHIL by newf84
November 09, 2017, 10:36:14 PM

Off aromas by combat32
November 08, 2017, 01:35:35 PM

Hello from the SE UK by braybrook89
November 08, 2017, 03:54:18 AM

Hop Hash?? by Misayakagr
November 08, 2017, 03:27:31 AM

Apple cider by Trurobrew
November 07, 2017, 09:16:23 PM

Hello by BuddhaNole
November 07, 2017, 10:44:51 AM

Just checking in by steamyb
November 07, 2017, 09:12:19 AM

Coopers IPA with Cascade by TrickyTrickybrew
November 06, 2017, 10:53:31 PM

Maltsmiths IPA Clone by combat32
November 06, 2017, 08:00:11 PM

Powered by EzPortal